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True on all counts but it probably won't be long until it sells well. The Chinese government is throwing a lot of money behind it and even if the US doesn't certify it for political reasons, there is a huge global market starving for fresh air frames.


I think would not be exactly political. The part where the plutocracy benefits the interests of a few pockets would certainly be political, but by other part, the major aircraft manufacturers in the EU and the UE, build civil aircraft as well as military ones.

As I understand it, to torpedo these companies by dumping prices would be to indirectly torpedo the EU's and the UE's defense aircraft production. A cost based production battle would be never won against China. And I guess many taxes would be earmarked to counteract this, again.

By other side, the rampant lack of quality in Chinese products and the inability to produce enough planes if they were contracted, in my guess would translate into the quick construction of factories with the worst production quality yet to be seen, for to feed the dumping.

The matter is, in such scenario we as consumers would be deeply affected, as civil aircraft manufacturing is already at the limit of what can be done without compromising safety (seriously, some managers should have been fired a few years ago, The aim should not be to imitate the lack-quality of the Chinese industry).

I don't want to think about what would happen if a race to cut manufacturing costs were endemically launched in the civil aircraft sector. As European I don't want to see it. If it were, lets say, the Japanese industry, the high quality one, not the one that is offshoring production to China, I wouldn't be worried about it or comment on it.

This is mere guessing, I'm not in the sector (It would be interesting to find objective researches on this matter in fact).


Why do you assume out of hand they would be low quality? We see in other industries, such as the Chinese military industry, that they are capable of producing a lot of high quality air frames. Their stealth J-20 has never had an accident in the 13 years it's been flying and they are building 120 per year, and flying them tens of thousands of hours per year.

You can look at other models. Their Xian Y-20 freighter has also never had an accident and flies tens of thousands of hours per year.

This isn't 1992 anymore where the only things coming out of China are plastic molded injection crap.


  Why do you assume out of hand they would be low quality?
The short answer? Peers and past performance as a predictor of the future. Transport aircraft are way more complex and held to higher standards than military aircraft. Or look at where the SSJ100, SpaceJet, ARJ-21 and C919 are today. COMAC's delivered four C919s in three years and has yet to get EASA or FAA certification. Most of the C919 orders are from big Chinese banks or leasing companies with no clear interest from airlines (domestic or foreign).


The military ones are Russian engineering assisted, iirc. The ones we should look at for airlines would be the Comac C919 ( and progressively C929 and C939).

https://theaircurrent.com/china/china-eastern-comac-c919-ret...

> Launch airline China Eastern’s tentative February 28 entry-into-service date never materialized [..]

> After regularly operating as part of its route proving, the aircraft appeared to change tempo on February 2. The aircraft flew a half dozen more short flights before February 27 then sat for nearly a month before being ferried from Hongqiao to nearby Pudong on March 23 when it was last seen. There’s been no definitive explanation for the jet’s return to the manufacturer.

Apparently they didn't copied well the stolen designs from American and European manufacturers[1] or there was a quality issue with the delivered aircraft. I think the Chinese government wants EU approval to use European citizens as alpha-testers.

https://www.reuters.com/business/aerospace-defense/china-eas...

> China Eastern Airlines (600115.SS) said on Thursday it will buy another 100 C919 airplanes in a deal worth $10 billion at list prices, in what would be the largest ever order for the jet made by the Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China (COMAC).

> The state-owned carrier said it had received a "substantial discount" for the deal and that the planes will be delivered in batches from 2024 to 2031. The list price for the C919 is $99 million but aircraft can be sold at discounts of up to 50%, especially for new models.

50% of the EU and the UE aircraft prices. It should be expected prices dumping, the same that happened when Hawuei and ZTE was subsidizing antennas and selling equipment at lower prices than manufacturing costs in the European Union.

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Comac_C919#US_espionage_allega...


The J-20 and Y-20 have absolutely zero russian input.


Aside from the engines.


J-20 is now powered by Chinese WS-15.

Y-20 is now powered by Chinese WS-20.


the the rumors say J-20 Russian MiG based design, Y-20 North-American based designs,

from whom have designs been stolen this time?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xi%27an_Y-20#Controversy




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